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So, Im up at Home Despot looking at heaters. The kerosene heater I want uses 1.9 gallons of fuel for a runtime of 9 hours. However, a small propane heater that uses 1# bottles operates at 18 hours. (Admittedly, I need to know the # of BTU’s each device produces.) So, that means that 1# of propane at $1.90 gives as many hours of heat as almost 4 gallons of kerosene (at $4.50~ a gallon). Plus the propane stores easier. Hmmmm. It cant be that simple…theres gotta be a major difference in BTU output. Next time I go up there I need to investigate this further. Cheaper and more efficient are the hallmarks of the Commander Zero lifestyle. Additionally, the propane heater is less expensive than the kero heater. Curiouser and curiouser. I know kero burns hot so Im betting the tradeoff here is in BTU’s. If anyone has a link to a source listing the relative BTU output of various fuels, Id certainly be interested.
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Im torn on the FAL….I know I want a .308 semi-auto rifle but that really limits my choices to the FAL, M1A, AR-10 type and the HK91. At the moment the HK91 has mags for as little as $2 ea. A huge attraction. But the guns are very very expensive, dont have a last shot hold open, and arent the most optic-friendly. The FAL is a great design, mags are cheap and plentiful, but I think the sights are just too crude. The M1A is nice but mags are a bit spendy these days and im not sure if thats going to change in the near future. The AR-10 (The Bushmaster model)  looks really really promising what with it taking FAL mags and all, but Im not terribly enamored of the AR gas system. I think for now I’ll hold onto the FAL and see about swapping out the sights for something a little more A2’ish.
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I need to find a source for decently priced mylar bags (food grade) in various sizes. What Id LOVE to find is a place that’ll sell me a roll of the stuff so I can just make my own bags. Those mylar bags are great things…airtight, watertight, lightproof…mmmm-mmm.
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I need to also pick up some topo map software…I plan on spending alot more time out in the sticks next year, so itd be nice to have some good maps.

24 thoughts on “”

  4. Kerosene; the way to go.

    I know you’re married to the whole propane concept, but I really think kerosene is the way to go.

    My Kero-Sun put’s out enough heat to make Chernobyl look like a freon accident. Also, —I— can fuel it, not some guy in a pressurized tank truck that may or may not make it through the snow. I can also consolidate half empty contaiers of kerosene into full ones.

    With propane you have to have the heavy steel containers; larger containers must be professionally refilled; you can not, with any degree of ease, slip over to your neighbors barbecue and siphon off a little to ‘top your tank’.

    I’d go with kerosene.

    Also, it’s suitable for lighting.

  5. Saiga

    Saiga makes an “AK” in .308/7.62mm NATO. They are reliable, fairly accurate, and reasponably priced. You’re limited to 8 round mags for the moment, but with the ban gone I’d expect hi-cap mags to become available soon.

  7. Propane has only convenience going for it, it is probably one of the worst sources for energy. It is worse than Natural Gas as well. It might be a good thing for backup to heat a small area. Not good for anything more than that.

    Propane does store a while though…

    Re: .308 rifles, I think between the AR-10 and the M1A, I’d pick the M1A. I haven’t shot enough with a FAL or HK91 to weigh in on those. I like both the AR-10 and M1A, and in a pinch I’d run with either. The AR-10 gets dirty faster because of the gas system, but it holds a slight edge in accuracy. They both kind of suck when it comes to magazine availability though. I know you want to have jillions and jillions. The cheapest I’ve seen 20 round M1A/M14 mags for is $30 each (USGI.)

  8. Here’s a table that shows the BTU content of various fuels. Kerosene comes in at 135k per gallon and propane is 91k per gallon. The rate of fuel consumption might give you a good idea of how many BTUs a heater can put out.

    I’m not sure what kind of heaters you’re looking at, but Mister Heater has some propane and kerosene heaters that are pretty much equivalent in terms of output. In spite of the silly name, I want to get a couple of their “Big Buddy” heaters which are suitable for indoor use. At 18k BTU output, it’s the biggest “indoor safe” portable heater that I can find.

    I want a .308 semi-automatic as well. I’ve been leaning towards an M1A, but I really haven’t put a lot of thought into it.

  9. Holy crap, where to start???

    From what Ive read, the majority of them had muzzle brakes welded on that are less than 100% true which makes the bullets do spectacular things when they leave the muzzle.

    When it comes to CETME/HK91 type rifles, accept no substitutes…if it aint stamped HK it aint worth gettin’…esp. for $300.

  10. Youre not reading far enough back. Kero is my #1 choice. Propane is coming in second. Where propane gives me a woody is if I ever build/buy a place in the sticks I can run generator, stove, refrigerator on propane.

    Of course, I could also run generator, furnace and a truck on diesel.

    Regardless, kerosene is my # fuel, although Im set up for kero, propane, gas and Coleman fuel.

  12. The Mister Heater is at the top of the list right now. Indoor safe, low oxygen sensor and can run on 1# or 20#…$75 locally. Its on the list. The Big Buddy is the one I was looking at. Looks like a good little unit with the features I need.

  15. I’ve got some experience with the Portable Buddy (MH9B) heaters. They are quite nice and do work as advertised. The only problem with them is that the tip over shutoff switch is very sensitve. Are you certain that the one you found locally wasn’t the smaller one? The cheapest I’ve been able to find the Big Buddy (MH18B) is $130. The worst thing about these heaters are the names.

    As for kerosene, I get mine locally from a gas station for about $2/gallon. You could use Jet-A in a pinch, which is running about $2.50/gallon now. It’s supposed to be higher-grade and have lower sulphur content than standard kero, but when it burns, it stinks like hell. For pricing on Jet-A, go here and give it your local airport code.

  16. [Propane]
    There’s also the Peak Oil consideration (which I talk true pessimism on, even though I don’t divert nearly enough cashflow).

    Kerosene has non-petroleum stocks available, they’re just not used right now. I’ll have to do some research; kerosene as biofuel isn’t totally unthinkable a priori.

    100% of the current propane supply is a byproduct of oil production. No cheap alternate pathways.

  19. Re: where?

    I wanna say it was Cheaper Than Dirt.

    Looks like the Germans are standardizing with the G36 so all that HK91 .308 stuff is gonna be surplus.

  20. Have you shot a roller lock H&K before? They are marvelously accurate and reliable, but they are hell on brass and have more recoil than other guns like chambered. If you are looking for long term survival with the intent to reuse your brass, you probably want to stay away from the H&K rifles.

    I am biased towards the FAL’s mostly because I have a couple of them, including one I hand built from a kit. They are extremely reliable, easy to maintain and parts are readily available. I agree that the standard sights are not as good as the M1A or ARs, but they can be easily upgraded with DSA/KNS Precision sights. The FAL isn’t the easiest rifle to mount optics to, but I have had great success with DSA and Tapco weaver dust cover scope mounts. I personally think the biggest obstacle to over come with the FAL is the trigger… only so much can be done to that. {sigh}

    I like the M1A, but for the price of one M1A, I can buy two FAL’s with 10 magazines for each and a case of surplus Australian 7.62 NATO… Plus, I have the tools and know-how to completely rebuild the FAL including rebarreling it and head spacing it if I ever shoot out a barrel.

    The only .308 AR I have ever shot was a SR-25– beautiful rifle and amazingly accurate, but it was set up to be a target rifle, not a drag-it-through-hell battle rifle, and thus had to be kept clean.

  21. Shit, man..I used to own an HK93. And Ive shot scads of HK91’s as well as the occasional MP5. No stranger to the HK system.

    Yeah, theyre reliable. No two ways about it. I never thought they beat up the brass to a point where it couldnt be reloaded. The fluting marks on the brass dont seem to make any difference.

    Howabout sending me a link or some info on the sights you mention? I was toying with going with some sort of AR-15 A@ rear sight like they make for flattop AR’s.

  22. I like the FAL. There are some custom replacement rear sights available. I don’t have any links, but go to http://www.falfiles.com and do some searches and you’ll find them.

    Fal Files is also a great source for cheap FAL mags. They can be found for as little as $4 NIW.

  23. Various FAL replacement sights:

    GG&G MAD BUIS Rear sight (currently used on many M4 carbines in the sandbox right now.) Also shown in the pic is their sling thing for the FAL for single point sling attachment… something I am contemplating…
    Volunteer Ordnance Works Para Rear Sight
    Pic showing VOW rear sight installed on an STG (non-para FAL)
    The VOW rear sights are also available from DS Arms
    KNS match front sights from DSA (cheaper than from KNS themselves)

  24. the initial rifle is still a bit expensive, but the Bushmaster .308 AR pattern rifle takes FAL mags.
    Bushy .308

    You get the best of several worlds. You get the MBR power of the M14/M1a, the standardized building block design & optics capability of the AR series, and the low mag price of the FAL. All that with decent accuracy too!

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