So, back to wargaming the Beta Site. I was thinking of using Uponor Pex for the basic interior water delivery needs. There are other options, of course, there’s the old-school copper piping which is going to be expensive, require a bit of work to cut and assemble, and isn’t exactly freeze-resistant. Pex, on the other hand, is easy to work with, goes together like Lego, and is less likely to burst if frozen. Additionally, it really adds itself to adding more connections and that sort of thing.
Uponor Pex connector and collar on L., regular Pex connectors and collars on R.
Uponor Pex with collars and connectors
Some plumbing experts I know have been nice enough to answer my questions and show me the various fittings and tools required to work with pex material. We took a piece of Uponor Pex, folded it in half so it had a kink that blocked water flow and then straightened it out. Waved a propane torch over it for a few minutes and the kink completely straightened out to the point that you couldnt even see a sign it was there. And, I am told, the structure of the Uponor Pex is such that when youo heat it up like that, the affected region becomes stronger than what it was before the kink in the pipe.
Connections were made by expanding the pipe and a collar, then slipping the expanded pipe over the connector, and the pex then constricted down to form a seal. The pex, I am told, will have memory that keeps it trying to constrict to its original dimension.
So I got to experiment with cutting, flaring, and otherwise playing with this stuff and its really hard to see a downside. My casual and uninformed opinion is that this stuff, if it lives up to its marketing, is awesome and perfect for my needs – its easy to use, durable, modular, allows for easy modifications, is freeze resilient, and won’t break the bank.
For a small structure, this seems like an ideal way to have an easily maintainable and flexible piping system within the structure. I need to investigate it more, but it seems like a good choice.
My concern with PEX of any type for potable water is leeching of both chemicals and nanoplastics. Uphonor is going to say that their product is tested and approved by regulatory agencies but I think the Covid episode has put paid to any idea that we should just take that at face value. There is research and documentation of chemical leeching and nanoplastic shedding but most of the people involved in that are from the anti oil crowd and it’s difficult to sort out all of the biases.
It does seem to be incontrovertible that all piping sheds a small amount of its material into the water passing through, and it depends on temperature, pressure, how long the water sits in the piping, and the presence of (or lack of) any chemicals in the water that can exacerbate the oxidation that occurs. It’s going to come down to whether you think a few chemicals and/or nanoplastics at very low ppm levels are a big deal. I personally have become rather sensitive to the issue of endocrine disruption and I’m trying to eliminate that stuff from my life to keep my T levels up and stay healthy.
If you do use the PEX I advise deploying an RO system at the sink for drinking and cooking water.
Slightly unrelated….but still Plumbing.
Do not overlook the virtues of SharkBite fittings of all variations.
They are amazing.
They have saved many an Amateur plumber.
+1 on sharkbite At the very least some end caps and connectors for repairs. Im leery on burying them in walls etc though.
Sharkbite shouldn’t be used in inaccessible locations. They will eventually fail. Sharkbite’s best use is for quick repairs until a permanent solution can be done.
Just remember to plum in a low spot with a drain. It’s freeze resistant not freeze proof.
From a DIY point of view, you need to make sure and have the tools for it obviously. A hacksaw and wrench won’t do it. Pretty standard in new home construction now. Considering your weather, I can’t imagine using anything else. You can even get colored fittings for it.-Redshirt Guy
Keep an eye out for biofilm build-up within lines that are not used often, and maybe spray the outside with capsaicin so the roving critters don’t chew a hole in any of the pipes.
Lots of fabric softener sheets and Ivory soap bars kept the mice from invading our camper after I replaced tubing in the cramped space under the shower.
There are no silver bullets, only trade-offs.
Pex is the best if there’s any chance of freezing.
I use the kind in the middle of your first picture, been very happy with it for years now
I wish alllll to hell that PEX was around when I re-did alll my home plumbing back in day >>> definitely use PEX over black pipe for gas supply to my garage ……
In a cold weather application PEX doesn’t have the same strength as copper if it is subjected to freezing conditions. However, it does have more “give” than copper, and will resist rupturing, so kind of a trade-off.
If you are looking at the possibility of lines freezing your best bet is to run heat trace on the line and insulate. Don’t bother with the cheap, unreliable heat tape you get at Home Depot, etc. Talk to an electrician and get some Thermon/Raychem. Yes, it comes as components and you have to put it together (there’s wiring and usually some cursing involved) but it will last for as long as you’re around. You can buy it in different amp/voltage ratings, and you cut it to length when you install it. It’s self regulating, so the colder it gets – the warmer it gets. I’ve had a piece on my well line for twenty years and it’s still going strong. Never had the well freeze up, and we hit -40 Celsius (40 below zero) for at least a week every year.
One additional thought. How is the water quality at the site. If the area has has high solids or calcium carbonate dissolved it it you will after a period of time determined by the solid count have buildup issues. In our area with the builds over the past few years mostly have pec lines and are starting to see some issues as time goes on. My friend has a cabin up at the end of a local valley that is slightly higher counts than lower areas and he had to pull parts of his lines due to blockage issues. If you will be able to easily get to the pec lines then no issues but if its behind lots of walls, that could be a major issue. If you put in some connections so you can flush the lines much like clean out connections on tank less on demand Hot water tanks use now that will save you some issues..
All of my best ideas are already posted, so i’ll try a couple of others:
1) try to locate all plumbing lines on non-exterior walls.
2) if you get a break-in, no one steals pex, but that copper is long gone.
I deal with a lot of mobile home freeze ups and the solution that has worked for me is using wiremold or cable hider on the interior wall with the 2 1/2 in pex lines inside it. It covers them and if you ever have to repair the pex the top cover pops off for easy access to the pipe.
PEX is great. Uponor PEX especially. Big thing to remember with PEX is that the inner diameter is smaller than equivalent sized copper, so go up a size or two for flow. Also, valves and tees are wonderful things, the ability to shut off every branch is important, and extra tees with valves and cap’d off stubs are a must for expansion.
I will second the recommendation for flush/purge points, PEX will build up a film in seldom-used branches, and calcium and lime will build up the same way it does in copper, despite some salesman’s claims otherwise.
As far as shark bite, it’s great for emergency work. I’ve seen it last for years on domestic piping, and as long as the piping/tubing is properly prepped it’s good to go. If you use it on hydronic heating runs it will work itself loose with the expansion/contraction from the heating & cooling of the pipes (though unless you’re planning a wood boiler I doubt you’ll go for hydronic heat). Another place shark bite shines is temporary work. Want to run an outdoor or stall shower off a water tank with an RV on-demand water heater? Few lengths of PEX, some shark bite fittings, it’s up and good to go. And when you’re leaving you pop it apart and store it, or if you’re done with it you set the lengths and fittings aside to use on another project
Hydronic heat is fantastic IF you can find cast iron radiators. They’re bulky and a bit obtrusive. It’s a bit slow to come up, but once it’s up, it stays up for a LONG time, and FAR more efficient than forced hot air.
This is because of the difference between radiated heat and just warm air.
If you feel comfortable with radiated heat in the 65-68F range (and many do) you will need forced air to be at least +5 degrees warmer for the same level of comfort.
It’s an energy wavelength thing.
Study thoroughly the differences between Pex A and Pex B. Professional homebuilders prefer Pex B. Neither A or B can withstand any exposure to sunlight.
Pex A is easier for the amateur to install but it gives the water a slight plastic taste.
Soft copper is best, but it can freeze only once or twice before bursting. Everything is a trade-off. BTW, when pipes burst, it’s not from ice expanding against the pipe. It’s from the increase in water pressure on either end of the freeze spot.
You’ll figure it out and be fine.
i have re-piped many old houses with it with great results. and it is easy to do add ons with.
pex does NOT like rodents or UV light, both will destroy it.
and for gods sake never ever use it for gas.
Zero- My water line from the week head to my 14×60 house trailer at my retreat is 110 feet and it’s PEX, buried about 16 inches. Never had an issue in 10 years but I admit I hooked up a schrader valve inside the trailer and a medium sized pancake compressor to blow the lines out when I leave after hunting season. This is the best way to make sure you don’t get burst water pipes in the winter. Quick and easy if you set it up from scratch like you’re planning on doing.
Following. Most readers cover many angles and insights. Concur on the blow out valve in line installations incorporated in your planning. If you are not present at your structure, summer or winter, it should be all shut off and purged or blown out. Thinking you will be back in a month or two to winterize the system may not happen due to unforseen events and a extreme cold snap damages components. If it is just a rural cabin and your not all concerned about asthetics, I would run all of your infrastructures in an open visible layout like the old navy ships so every thing (plumbing, electrical, communications, etc) can be monitored, is easily accessed for preventative maintenance or future upgrades or tie ins, and
for repair accessibility. Using your label maker and having a well thought out system will make your hermitage cabin as professionally built and run as a .MILITARY complex or starfleet spacecraft. Plan and build in for worst case scenarios and like many of the above listed probabilities planned out for, will help immensely.
This can be done with a basement or even a crawl space that’s planned to be easily accessible, while still preserving the aesthetics of the lived in portion.
Stem wall construction is a lot easier to pull off in remote locations because you only need a fraction of the amount of concrete that a slab requires. It also leaves a crawl space to access mechanicals including water and drain lines. Electrical distribution can be done there as well if you have a desire for vaulted ceilings, which don’t leave an accessible attic space.
For the crawl space, just plan for it to be 30-36″ tall, put down a full vapor barrier membrane (heavy plastic) and then cover it with 6″ of sand.
Thanks for feedback. Concur on your crawlspace points. My house is built that way on block perimeter walls and plumbing and electrical under it. I would just stress that it be well insulated with 2 inch foam panels on the foundation walls and a well sealed with foam rim joist pockets and an encapsulated sealed crawl space. Crawl space ninja on u tube has good tips. I am in zone 4 at 6k feet near continental divide with long winters. I just wish my 1980 design and built house was more thought out and hyper insulated to today’s capabilities. Great tips from every one!
I work at a utility in the PNW. We are changing copper over to PEX on all services, when the opportunity arises. We also require PEX on all new service connections.
Also of not, we use brass compression fittings instead of flares. You add a stiffener insert to end of pipe, then use brass compression fitting for your desired use. Just a thought.
That uponor tool (Milwaukee) is expensive, but well worth the money spent.
DeWalt has their version as well. The hand tool is a great workout, but if you plan to do more than 5 or so in a day, best to get the power tool.
I redid my BOL with pex. I used the copper inserts and the crimp rings. It’s quick and easy. To make changes, you just cut in, add a T, and run the branch off to the new bathroom… I bought a dedicated crimp tool for each size, and a ratcheting short tool that uses pinch rings for confined spaces.
I did put insulated rubber like sleeve over all my lines, in the attic, or in the walls. It was a bit of a PITA, but worth it to me. And I ran a separate circuit for the hose bibs so I can shut them off at one central point and then drain them.
I’d never run pex before, but a few videos took care of that. I had run copper, and pvc or cpvc, and even way back in the day made up iron pipe and cut threads, etc.
The house we bought as the BOL had copper thru the slab originally, but it had failed. Then the owner ran new copper from the attic, but it was mostly failed too. I hope the pex outlives me. Point is, everything fails given enough time. The advantages of pex over other modern choices are cost, ease of use, and ability to DIY.
I’ll be re-piping our main house with pex too.
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I ran all my own new propane lines too, using the yellow corrugated metal system that lowes and home depot stock. SO much easier than iron pipe or copper. I put in two manifolds, with valves for every line at the supply end and the use end. That makes changes easier and we can shut it all off if we need to. It’s only slightly more complicated to attach the ends than working with pex.
nick