I have a couple 9mm ARs. One is the Angstadt Arms version, which I recommend, and the other is the KE Arms version that uses the polymer lower receiver/stock combo. Both have their advantages…the KE arms is very, very light. The Angstadt has a last-shot hold open.
I had picked up a second Trijicon MRO last week and needed to get it sighted in for the KE Arms gun, so thats what I did today. Once dialed in, it was quite easy to chew the center out of the target dots. It’s a handy little carbine that shares magazines and ammo with my Glocks.
Every single time I post about pistol caliber carbines it invariably leads to “if youre going to carry a carbine why wouldnt you carry it in a carbine caliber” or “pistol caliber carbines are stupid” discussions in comments. Every single time. So, for the sake of my sanity and to save everyone some time, lets hit the search function and just go reread the older arguments and explanations.
Speaking of 9mm. I was flipping around some blogs and came across this picture:
My current carry ammo is the Speer Gold Dot. People I have talked to who would be ‘in the know’ say that it is the pellet of choice for people who have to deal with things that have language skills. I had a disappointing experience with HydraShocks once and, while recognizing it may have just been a fluke, I have been adamant about not using them. I think my nightstand gun still has Black Talons in it, which clearly shows how long its been since I rotated my ammo out of that particular gun. My ‘house gun’, the MP5SD clone, uses Hornady subsonic hollowpoints. I usually prefer 124 gr. in my unsupressed guns. Even FMJ will ‘do the job’ as long as ‘you hit them in the right spot’, but thats a rather stupid argument. A baseball bat will ‘do the job’ if you just ‘hit them in the right spot’, but I can tell you with experience under my belt that in the real world you don’t always get the luxury of setting up your shot to be perfect. Sometimes you gotta be the first with the most and when that happens youre gonna want a little bit of extra for that ‘margin of error’. Could you go elk hunting with a .22 Mag? Absolutely. Is it a good idea? Definitely not. Sure, a perfect shot in the perfect spot with the .22 Mag will drop an elk, but you don’t always get the perfect….and when that happens you want to have extra mass, extra speed, extra power on your side to make up for less-than-perfect placement.
Life isn’t perfect. Buy the hollowpoints.
In most episodes of actual shootery, the bad guys usually (depending on the level of meth in their system) skedaddle when the lead starts flying. Doesn’t matter what size, diameter or FPS. A Daisy Red Ryder would scare most folks off.
The key is: 1. Have a gun 2. Pull it and shoot it quickly.
A 9mm with alternating rounds of FMJ and Gold Dots is enough medicine for 99% of situations. When that runs dry, which would be about 30 rounds with a second mag, then retreat to access back up which is .45 AARP and 12 or 20 buckshot. If the threat isn’t gone by then FUBAR has arrived and we are screwed anyways.
Hey, CZ,
No criticisms from me! ARs in 9x19mm have some real advantages: (1) Lower ammo cost–and usefulness in handguns–makes it a viable choice for the budget-constrained prepper. (2) Not hard to suppress, and the subsonic ammo can be very
effective, even when compared to regular, supersonic 9mm. A prepper can even standardize on subsonic ammo, without any big drawbacks to the decision. (3) Fewer mags to buy, if your AR and pistol use the same mag. (4) Even unsuppressed, less damaging to hearing than 5.56mm, especially indoors. (5) Long barrels not needed. A 10-inch pistol has plenty of barrel for the 9mm, allowing for a compact AR without giving up the cartridge’s potential. (6) MUCH BETTER practical accuracy in most hands than a pistol. Some of us (with astigmatism) can’t use red dot (the “dot” becomes a comet when I look through the sight) sights, and a braced pistol or SBR–with a prism sight or irons with a ghost ring rear–is much more accurate–and faster–for me than a Glock 17 with iron sights. (7) Cheaper practice, and in more places. Even if your serious AR is in 5.56mm, it’s cheaper to practice with a 9mm, and you can do it at many indoor ranges, where the 5.56mm might not be allowed.
Respectfully,
Bob G
Thanks for the write-up and the information. Also appreciate the KE Arms mention, didn’t know about them & sort of looking for a 9mm AR.
Always enjoy your posts
Dont be tempted to cheap out. If you want a good quality 9mm AR you need to resign yourself to spending somewhere around a grand. There are plenty of lower-priced 9mm AR’s but you get what you pay for. Get one with a dedicated Glock magwell rather than a regular AR magwell that has an adapter pinned into it.
I standardized on the .40S&W years ago. I was pleasantly surprised to find that a PCC shooting 180 grain ammo hits as hard as a subsonic .300 Blackout. That ended my need for another caliber and made me feel better about a PCC as a truck gun. I carry a Glock when I walk my 40 acre wooded property. Having a suppressed PCC along simplifies things considerably.
I like your ‘House gun’ Z. I currently use an Sig Copperhead for the home defense role, loaded with Winchester 147 gr ‘train & defend’ HP. Reason I selected them & grain weight was a video of an autopsy and the perp was shot twice in the chest. The damage they did was massive & sold me on them.
Light, shake-awake dot, and a Mojave suppressor…and if I have time, plate carrier and gloves.
Home invasion will probably look similar to this:
Perfect setup!
What is a 9mm “AR?” Is it an Armalite Rifle? Is it gas impingement? Or just a rifle with a fairly straight stock and a pistol grip?
Well, since theres a picture of two of them in that post, I’d say its a bit self-explanatory – a 9mm carbine/rifle in the AR-style platform.
Due to astigmatism, I’m selling my MRO’s and using prismatics instead. Maybe I’ll drop them at Frontier on consignment-I’ll let you know if I do.
Why don’t you email me when youre ready to sell, and let me know a price and what they come with (mounts, etc.) and perhaps we can work something out.
What’s your email?
https://www.commanderzero.com/?page_id=24
In a free state like yours, with 33-rd Glock happysticks, placement becomes a lesser consideration, one would think. It’s not so much a question of first-hit nirvana, as much as it is the next 5 to 10 rounds flying in right behind the first round.
Any number of quick sights suffice, but I still have the cheapest piece of Chinese 3-9x glass sold at WallyWorld on my PC-9, since I first purchased it, which proved boringly capable of consistent teacup-sized X-ring hits at both 100Y and 200Y, offhand.
Under 50Y is where the red dots and such shine.
Why wouldn’t one grab an actual carbine-caliber?
Because those mags won’t fit in a Glock, and for anything farther than 200Y, I’d prefer to be using something in .308, if it’s justifiable.
Having those rounds flying about in a closer fight, including indoors, or in a suburban neighborhood, isn’t generally such a nifty plan.
PC carbines are a poor man’s semi-auto Sten, Uzi, or Tommy gun, and just as effective if not more so, with no muzzle climb. And in free states, they can also be drastically suppressed.
And different strokes for different folks.
Have any of you noticed that the swat types have been switching from 9mm to 5.56 for entry guns? Reason being that wall penetration of normal home construction is fairly modest, while 9mm will blow through multiple houses’ worth of walls. Could help keep your family and neighbors a bit safer if you don’t get good hits in the excitement. 7.62 is similarly wall friendly.