Well zowie!
I got the new Bushmaster catalog today and, surprise!, Bushmaster is making a gas-piston AR and they are alos selling a gas-piston upper. Looks promising. Bad news is that they want upwards of a grand just for the upper.
I like the AR platform for its ergonomics and modularity. Its reliability, however, isnt what Id like it to be and that is mostly because of its direct impingement system. Add a FAL/AK style of gas operation and I think you’ve got the a wonderful new beast.
I wouldvery very much like to get a review on one of these. I’d be willing to sell of a few of my current Bushies to get a couple with the new gas system.
Leitner-Wise-esque or POF/FAL-gas-plug-esque piston upper? Or a completely new design? Chrome lined? 5.56 or .223 chamber?
What I desperately want is for RRA to make an LAR-10 upper for their FAL mag AR10 variant that has a Leitner-Wise style gas piston gas system AND a chrome lined barrel (not boring old chrome moly). Getting these manufacturers to make this combination is like pulling teeth. Until I can get a FAL mag/chrome lined/gas piston in one AR10 package, Im not gonna be interested.
I’m in the “wait and see” mode when it comes to the new breed of gas piston uppers. I believe that they have the potential to be much more reliable, but without hard facts, I’m not going to jump onto it. Especially since the parts are pricey and not as widely available as your standard AR parts. (Which you can basically find almost anywhere right now.)
It’d be nice if they had gas-piston uppers with the 20″ M16-style A3 style. I don’t really like M4s, except if I’m going to be lugging one around all day.
I’ll wait a little while for the kinks to get ironed out and the prices to come down (I hate being a “beta tester” for new hardware, computer or otherwise) before I’d consider one.
Of course, my Bushmaster XM15 gobbles up dirty Wolf 55gr FMJ ammo all day long without any malfunctions when I used good magazines (mostly milsurp, though I have the one Bushmaster magazine that came with the rifle). At the end of the day, a quick cleaning of the action, bolt, bolt carrier, and barrel keeps it running smoothly. I really haven’t had any reliability issues at all with it, so I’m in no hurry to get a gas-piston upper.
Still, it’d be interesting to see the new designs.
Hmmm…. Think Bushy will sell them in sub-16″ lengths?
Sig’s new gas piston design?
What do you think of the new(ish) Sigarms 556 rifle? Same AR-15 magazines, same gas piston operating system, and at ~$1,200 for the whole thing a heck of a lot cheaper than the bushmaster option.
Drawbacks? Accessory compatibility, unproven durability and quality, and lack of plentiful replacement parts. At first blush it seems like a cross between an AR-15 and a G36.
I’ve been a fan of Sig for a while, so I’m biased and looking for more objective opinions.
A la HK416?
Re: Sig’s new gas piston design?
Too many people get wrapped up around the whole DI vs piston systems after the intro of the HK416 without knowing anything about the situation behind it. A specific military unit had requirements that exceeded the design parameters of the AR system. These requirements are not what most here, or even in the regular military, will have to deal with. That’s why the whole piston AR came about. The Di works just fine otherwise….even in the desert. 🙂
Gas piston AR’s only become useful for the “regular” schmoe when barrel length gets less than 14 inches or you shoot a HUGE amount(parts wear due to heat). Direct impingement gets blamed for reliability too much when the problem is usually from something else, usually poor workmanship from the company. Piston systems also do nothing for reliability regarding foreign debris in the action. Crap gets in that will choke it, WILL choke it, including the “legendary” AK. Unless you pushed your AR past its design limits, your reliablity issues likey came from poor QC rather than direct impingement. If this is a matter of need and not want, ask yourself these questions:
Will you be using a gas length shorter than 14.5 inches?
Will you use it for extensive full auto?
Will you be unable to lube it at all for long periods?
Will you be supressing it often?
If you’re set on a gas piston upper, look at the Lietner-Wise uppers. They have an excellent PROVEN design, and are the closest to the HK416. And you can actually get one.
Yes and no. While tighter tolerances do affect reliability, it’s not as significant as most have come to believe. It’s usually over tightening or improper tightening of the tolerances that lead to a significant drop in reliability.
If crap gets into the action, the possibility for malfunction exists, DI or piston. It’s not only the chamber after all. I’ve heard the stories of shoveling crap into an AK action and it still firing. I’ve also witnessed the results when that happens under real conditions. The guys firing the AK’s were none too happy, but only for a brief moment. 🙂 DI M4’s ran fine. Also, the HK416, famed for its reliability, holds the same tolerances as an M4. Only the gas system and BCG have changed. More room for crap to fall out also can lead to more crap getting stuck in. Looser parts also increase rate of wear on parts.
The 1911 was once known for it’s extreme reliability under all conditions. This was when the pistol was made tight, before wartime needs forced looser tolerances of parts for mass production. Deviation and cost cutting is what changed that. I guess a lot can be said for “not making it tight, but making it right”.
Re: Sig’s new gas piston design?
While HK had a product improvement program that they had offered to the US gov, no one took it. The HK416 didn’t get off the ground until said military unit took HK up on the offer. And this was because they were using the Stoner system beyond what it was designed to do. So it was less of “carving out a niche”, and more of “solve this issue”.